Forum not very busy Opciones

[Kwiebuz]

This forum is not very much visited, the most actually by Dutch people, which I think is a pity. Personally I think this is because the Spanish are not only chauvinistic and impolite, they're also rude, no effort is taken by most to answer a question in English when it's posted in the Spanish forum(because nobody reads the English one). The French are a good example of this same hilarious behaviour and I don't think this will ever change, so the guys who run this forum can close it down if it's up to me, because it isn't and won't be a success at all...

PS. Did you know the French are trying to ban English words from their vocabulary, now they've started an action to stop people using terms like E-mail and World Wide Web, any of you Spanish people can tell me if you have the same idiotic habit of making Spanish words for everything???

Maybe it's just me who's too negative, but it's really the way I see this, the Spanish have an attitude problem, I can't make anything more out of it, a nice example for Dutch people visiting Spain sometimes, have you noticed how many Spanish people just bump in to you??? They just won't move inch to the left or right for you, expect you to move for them, but that's not how it works ofcourse, especially a country that relies for such a great part on tourism should treat it's visitors in a proper way.

Kwiebuz (Who obviously isn't going to Spain this year's vacation and understands this message is a little off-topic, but doesn't really care much about it.)

[JCARLOS]

By reading your message i think that the attitude problem is yours. Sadly there's a lot of rude people in this forum, and believe me when i say that sometimes not getting and answer is better than some of the replies i've read. Anyway, not all the people in Spain are like this. Some of us like formula 1 and like to exchange opinions with people about it, doesn't matter if it's in spanish or english. I don't think that finding a couple of idiots is enough to make a judgement like the one you've made. And about the activity in this forum, i think that it's still young, let's give it a couple of weeks to see what happens.

And one last thing. I'm sorry if you didn't enjoy your time in Spain for all the people bumping into you, which i believe is not common occurrence, but i tell you the same as before: it doesn't give you the right to tell we don't treat people 'in a proper way'. It would be very easy to say something like that about all the dutch or english 'people' that spent their holidays in Spain getting drunk, brawling and disturbing every women they find. Believe when I say there's a lot of them, but i'm not saying that dutch or english people are drunks or should learn how to treat women.

[Adeur]

If you keep on saying that the spanish are chauvinistic and impolite, don't hope to get an answer from us. What would you think about me if I say in the verstappen forum that the Dutchs are chauvinistic and impolite? (by the way, we have a forum in english but you have only a forum in Dutch. That is not nice but...)

Please don't make such afirmations over 40 Million people. It will never be true. There is spanish people who are chauvinistic an impolite as well as there are Dutch people who are chauvinistic and impolite, but it doesn't mean that the most of the people are so.

Adeur (Who thinks that Kwiebuz's opion over Spain is wrong.)

[nacho]

There are always stupid and ignorant people around, no matter where you are. And the spanish forum is not an exception. Yesterday I read some idiot´s message there complaining about certain messages being posted in English there. But you shouldn´t really be affected by those nonsense, let alone gather an incorrect impression of our culture and customs. Most people in Spain are amiable and willing to learn from foreigners and to share things with them. And of course we use lots of english words, and it seems to me like it´s the best as most of the times the translations to spanish sound downright ridiculous.
Another point you should bear in mind is that down here in Spain, the general knowledge of English language is low, low, low. Converse to what happens in Holland, Sweden or Germany, where all you seem to speak fluent English! But the situation will improve. In some years´ time your children will enter spanish F1 forums and get answered in English without further delay.
Thanx!

[Bartus]

I would say the decency of the answers given to the somewhat provocking message of Kwiebus tells me the WWW in Spain is still not (yet) crowded with idiots that use national pride as a matter of conflict. I must admitt that I fully agree with Kwiebus' opnion of the French, but this is not at all what I think about the Spanish. I like being here and I like your attitude, although as said above, there are exceptions. I would assume Kwiebus has been visiting the gym a bit too often which made him so big everybody is bumping into him ;-)

Bartus(who also likes the food in Spain)((Yes, I know, the food in Catalunya is evwen better ;-))

[xotazu]

Hello dutch and spanish fans:

I think it is a pity that so many people believe in the usual topics around other nations, and show their feelings in a so rude ans unpolite way. I am telling this for the spanish fans and for the dutch as well. There are polite spanish people and very unpolite spanish people ... and obviously, there are polite dutch people and very unpolite dutch people. In my opinion the best solution is to ignore unpolite and rude messages and people. This forum is a perfect image about what is world and humans beings. It is difficult to live close to many people, there are people who doesn't feel good close to other ones, and there always will be problems. But problems have to be reduced as many as posible, and one of the ways is to ignore them (unpolite people and problems).

I have to accept that in both the english and spanish forum there are many unpolite fans. I am really scared about the extremely rude language used by those people. They are completely unable to accept opinions opposite to their own opinions, but people not interested in stupid discussions should ignore them. Unfortunately in the english forum there unpolite spanish and dutch people, but there are also polite ones.

Then, the best way is to ignore and not answer to people who is speaking loud, crying, and attacking to the rest.


I think it is a very good oportunity to talk with dutch people about Arrows, Jos and Pedro. Even I really believe it is very interesting to speaking about 'Is Jos better than Pedro?', but not only in the very stupid way of dutch people only telling 'Jos is the best' and spanish people only telling 'Pedro is the best' finally converging into a neolitic inflamed words-war. There are many ways to tell this, and I think there are many spanish people ready to speak in a civilized way, as well as many dutch people. Therefore, here is my opinion.


In one side, I thin Pedro is one of the best pilots in the present F1. His curriculum before F1 is really impressive, one of the bests among actual F1 pilots, and last year he showed he is able to beat a really fast more experienced team mate. With last year bad car it was very diffcult to judge him, but since the A21 is running, Pedro is really pushing hard. The winter test were really incredible. He was fastest than the Arrows technical staff believes it was possible. He broke the 1:23:00 barrier that staff stated as limit to the A20-motor/A21-chassis combination. When finally running the complete A21, he and Jos were nicely fighting for the Montmelo record, braking it day after day. Then I thought Jos is a very good driver. During weekly, friday, saturday test and warm-ups Pedro is often faster than Jos, but they have always been very close. I think they are very good drivers, and at the moment they are very similar in performance. But Jos has been clearly better than Pedro during races (remember he was sticked at M Schumacher's Ferrari for many laps!!!), and that is the most important for the championship. But I see an advantadge for Pedro. Jos is more experienced than Pedro, therefore I think it will be diffiult to see Jos performs better than now. But Pedro is a 'rookie' in F1 and he has a clear potential to be better race after race. I think that at the end of the present season Pedro will be a little bit better than Jos. Tom Walkinshaw seems very happy with Pedro, and he was confident on Jos, therefore we should believe they are very good drivers.

Changing about topic, here is a question which is in my mind for some time ago: If Arrows has a very big budget, why don't to recover the project to build a home made engine like last year? When somebody develops something, he knows exactly what is happening into them, and that is the first step to achieve the excelence. With so many money, why don't research in a new engine?



Edited by - xotazu on 4/27/2000 12:41:16 PM

[JCARLOS]

Xotazu

In my opinion, Arrows made the right decission forgetting the idea of developing their own motor. I believe that the reason they've got more sponsors and, as a consequence, more money this season, is because the tests in the pre-season showed a big potential for the car. If they had invested in their own engine, i don't think they would have got the results that attracted those sponsors. And if they want to be a competitive team, they need the money badly. The question will be if the your idea would have given better results at the end of the season, but we better discuss this when it's over.

[Kevlar]

Xotazu:

You're absolutely right in the way we should contribute to this forum. I can even follow your analyses of Pedro's and Jos' driving skills. But I guess we differ on at least one opinion. When you say you think that Jos has already reached his peak performance I think you're wrong. You must not forget that he hasn't raced properly for almost two years. It takes a while to be able to race on the limits again. Pedro has the advantage of havin' raced the previous year, and already feels comfortable with the team. Trust me, when Jos has build enough self-confidence (which means that he has brought the car home a couple of times) he will go for it again, like he used to do. I think he feels he must shake the "gravel king-syndrome" first and show that he can drive reliably.

Regards, Kevlar

[xotazu]

Kevlar,

Yes, probably you are right telling that Jos is not in his peak performance. I didn't follow Jos performance some seasons ago. But I think it is very good that them both are not in their best moments. Jos and Pedro are very good drivers, I think so, and I like very much to follow their extremely nice fight for the best lap during tests, qualif, races and so (wishing that Pedro beats Jos [;-)] ). I think that if Pedro and Jos are able to work hard together and respect each other, it will be very good for them and for the team. I have the feeling that they could be a very good team and that them both have a huge potential. But, unfortunately, I also have the feeling that their relation is not very good. It is difficult to see them talking or working together, I think there is a certain distance among them, and if this is true it would be a pity.

Juan Carlos:

You are right telling that the money has arrived to Arrows because of his testing results (because of his new chassis and Supertec engine), and precisely I think that now it is very good moment to restart the home-made engine. You have to take opportunities when you are able to take it, and if the opportunity is called 'money' ... take it! In two years Arrows will need a new engine (Supertec contract finishes in to years), and I think that two years with a so great budget for research and a previous experience in building an engine is enough to build a very good motor.



Edited by - xotazu on 4/27/2000 4:17:08 PM

Edited by - xotazu on 4/27/2000 4:18:13 PM

[JCARLOS]

Xotazu

You have a good point there regarding the development of a home-made engine. Thinking like that seems very reasonable, but only one consideration: the Supertec contract finishes in two years, yes, but i'm afraid that the sponsorship contract with Orange and Repsol covers only this year. That means that if they don't have good results this year, maybe the budget for next season will be very short. So probably they are putting every effort in the current season hoping to cover their sponsors' expectations. If everything goes well, next year will be a better time for a mid-term planning.

JC

[xotazu]

Ok, You are right. First it's necessary to obtain good results to prove that the team is a front-row team and there are a lot of probabilities to perform better. I see your point and it is very ok. But i would like to add: Don't you think that redearch is a very good reason to ask for more money? If Arrows begins to develop a new engine, the next year it could tell the sponsors that the team needs more money, or at least the same, to build a really competitive and leader engine. I am working in scientific research, and when a project is started the amount of people working in the project increases and the money needed is higher. I don't want to tell Arrows what they have to do, but if they begins to develop, or improve, a new engine they could increase their research staff and this is a very good reason to ask for more money. As usually in scientific research, people only needs time to get what they want. If sponsors supply money for a period of time, soon or later the results will be achieved, the team will be a front-row and sponsors will be happy.

[Kevlar]

Xotazu,

Yes, I think you're right. There is a distance between the two drivers, but that's all right. They don't need to be friends, as long as they respect each other and do their jobs as teammates. BTW, Jos never talks about his teammates. I guess that's because he's 100% focused on his own job, not on his "compañero" (he got along with Michael Schumacher quite well at Benetton though). Probably Pedro is easier to get along with then Jos. Maybe we'd give it some time...

[Johan V]

JCARLOS

: the Supertec contract finishes in two years, yes, but i'm afraid that the sponsorship contract with Orange and Repsol covers only this year.

If I recall correctly, the Orange sponsorship was for the next three years. The 70m UKP sponsorship money will be spread over three years.

Johan V

[Johan V]

xotazu:

> If Arrows has a very big budget, why don't to recover the project to build a home made
> engine like last year? When somebody develops something, he knows exactly what is happening
> into them, and that is the first step to achieve the excelence. With so many money,
> why don't research in a new engine?

Yes Arrows has a lot of sponsons, and the money provided by these sponsors will help the team very nicely. But developing a competitive engine requires an enormous amount of money. And frankly I don't think Arrows has that kind of money to spare.

The supertec is a decent engine. But what the team really needs is a works engine deal. They need the backing of a large car companie, or else they'll never reach the (sub)top.

Johan V.

[Johan V]

Adeur:

(by the way, we have a forum in english but you have only a forum in Dutch. That is not nice but...)

Actually, there are two version of the Jos Verstappen site, one in Dutch, the other in English. The forum is an exception, the forum is only situated on the English version! (there is a link from the dutch site to the english forum though).

Before entering the verstappen-forum, you see the following message:

Although not necessary, we would appreciate it when you write your statements in English so our international visitors can read your statement. However, this is not a rule, if you prefer to write in Dutch, go ahead. The only rule we have is that if a comment is started in English, you must write your reaction to it in English!

Johan V

btw what does:

1. Marca aquí para añadir la firma de tu ficha.
2. Marcando esto se te recuerdan detalles.

mean.

[nacho]

1-click here to enclose your file´s signature
2-By clicking here you´ll be reminded of details
I have no idea what this last means!

[AbcdE]

It means your password and username will be saved for your next post and you won't have to put it again